Isildur doesn't have a grasp on the db economy.

[Jarvel]

Originally Posted by Jean Gris

But grinding is the only way money comes into the game, you can't "grow" doubloons on a lot ....

Doesn't matter.. There are so many in the game without money sinks in place it's never been a problem at all. Labor can be used to generate doubloons, and labor is something earned even without logging in.. Very convenient and much better than grinding.. Just doing PvE missions will get you the money needed to get started..

[flaknugget]

Originally Posted by Jarvel

Doesn't matter.. There are so many in the game without money sinks in place it's never been a problem at all. Labor can be used to generate doubloons, and labor is something earned even without logging in.. Very convenient and much better than grinding.. Just doing PvE missions will get you the money needed to get started..

Labour hours, and the right structures can be applied to grow DB at a rate of about 20-40%. Profit margins are slightly more for tedious, time-consuming recipes like canvas, wine, or provisions.

Not 20-40% per day, but that is the return you can expect from selling everything you ever craft, no matter how long it takes. It is a slow and unpredictable economy today.

You'll still need to grind you're way into the market, and I don't believe anyone can survive this game from trading alone. It certainly couldn't pay for a PvP centric player's expenses.

[Jarvel]

Originally Posted by flaknugget

Labour hours, and the right structures can be applied to grow DB at a rate of about 20-40%. Profit margins are slightly more for tedious, time-consuming recipes like canvas, wine, or provisions.

Not 20-40% per day, but that is the return you can expect from selling everything you ever craft, now matter how long it takes. It is a slow and unpredictable economy today.

You'll still need to grind you're way into the market, and I don't believe anyone can survive this game from trading alone. It certainly couldn't pay for a PvP centric player's expenses.

You are incorrect, but you are also free to believe as you wish.. Grind away.. What's important is that you find the method of obtaining DB's that best fits your play style and in-game decisisons..

I find the AH to be far superior, and I especially appreciate that I don't have to waste online time to do it. One of FLS's best moves in the game. Like ship combat, most people haven't learned how to play the benefits FLS has put into the economic game. The more we learn, the better we get at it though..

Now, if only the populations hold while we learn, but that's another topic for another thread..

[Jean Gris]

No one is asking for free ships or "no loss" pvp. Why do people always bring that argument out in response to threads asking for more doubloon drops to lessen the grind needed for pvp? Hell, I'm one of the people wanting a full pvp server lol.

Even if you are doing fine and are quite successful in pvp now .. why be against lowering the grind? It wouldn't hurt your gameplay at all. In fact, you'd see alot more people out in the red circle.

[flaknugget]

Originally Posted by Jarvel

You are incorrect, but you are also free to believe as you wish.. Grind away.. What's important is that you find the method of obtaining DB's that best fits your play style and in-game decisisons..

I find the AH to be far superior, and I especially appreciate that I don't have to waste online time to do it. One of FLS's best moves in the game. Like ship combat, most people haven't learned how to play the benefits FLS has put into the economic game. The more we learn, the better we get at it though..

Now, if only the populations hold while we learn, but that's another topic for another thread..

So it's the players who are failing to learn, and not the game failing to engage the players.

And you hope the population will stabilize long enough for things to work.

Like you say... "you are also free to believe as you wish"

[Jarvel]

Originally Posted by Jean Gris

No one is asking for free ships or "no loss" pvp. Why do people always bring that argument out in response to threads asking for more doubloon drops to lessen the grind needed for pvp? Hell, I'm one of the people wanting a full pvp server lol..

Because it's the same.. Why do you want more free DB's dropped??

It doesn't matter if the DB's were free, or the ship was free. It's the same outcome..

I say you have to pay for a ship, but I give you 100,000 db's free.. How much did YOU pay for your ship?

Half empty, half full.. Trying to sell one off as being better than the other..

[kazamx]

Originally Posted by Jarvel

Because it's the same.. Why do you want more free DB's dropped??

It doesn't matter if the DB's were free, or the ship was free. It's the same outcome..

I say you have to pay for a ship, but I give you 100,000 db's free.. How much did YOU pay for your ship?

Half empty, half full.. Trying to sell one off as being better than the other..

NO, I believe what people are looking for is more of a resource limited economy, rather than a db limited economy.

[trongey]

Originally Posted by flaknugget

So it's the players who are failing to learn, and not the game failing to engage the players...

The problem is that it's both.

Those of us who read the forums for all those years before release knew what FLS was trying to do. We're playing the game that way, and enjoying it. I've got maybe 25-30 hours into the game. I'm only a level 10 in a Renard with about 10k db to spend. I'm having a really good time sailing around and doing piratey things. Nobody fears me, nobody even respects me. Heck, nobody even bothers to gank me.

Unfortunately, FLS didn't do a good enough job of explaining their vision to the masses. Hordes of players flocked in from WoW, Eve, etc. expecting the game to work the way they were used to playing (which begs the question of why they came in the first place). Now they're doing all the stuff they hated in the other games, and it doesn't even work like they expect. Of course they're unhappy.

I don't know exactly what the answer is. It's probably too late for FLS to educate the masses. The masses probably don't even care, because they don't want to play the game that FLS designed. I'd personally hate to see PotBS changed into the kind of game the masses are seeking (WoW-on-Boats), because I like the game they designed.

Does FLS have deep enough pockets or low enough overhead to wait for the player base to match their design, or will they have to cave to the dollar god?

[Alejandra]

Originally Posted by trongey

The problem is that it's both.

Those of us who read the forums for all those years before release knew what FLS was trying to do. We're playing the game that way, and enjoying it. I've got maybe 25-30 hours into the game. I'm only a level 10 in a Renard with about 10k db to spend. I'm having a really good time sailing around and doing piratey things. Nobody fears me, nobody even respects me. Heck, nobody even bothers to gank me.

Unfortunately, FLS didn't do a good enough job of explaining their vision to the masses. Hordes of players flocked in from WoW, Eve, etc. expecting the game to work the way they were used to playing (which begs the question of why they came in the first place). Now they're doing all the stuff they hated in the other games, and it doesn't even work like they expect. Of course they're unhappy.

I don't know exactly what the answer is. It's probably too late for FLS to educate the masses. The masses probably don't even care, because they don't want to play the game that FLS designed. I'd personally hate to see PotBS changed into the kind of game the masses are seeking (WoW-on-Boats), because I like the game they designed.

Does FLS have deep enough pockets or low enough overhead to wait for the player base to match their design, or will they have to cave to the dollar god?

even you will eventually hit lvl 50 and not have a ****en clue what to do other than grind or pvp. And pvp requires grinding, and the only thing to spend Db on is PvP...so you can either horde money or be broke because you enjoy PvP...just because it took you longer to get here does not change the inevitable result.

[Envoy]

The initial concept behind the DB changes were sound. The idea, IMO, was to force players into using cheaper disposable ships to engage in large scale PvP. Simply because they wouldn't have the money to throw away on the larger ships.



This failed, it didn't fail because the idea wasn't sound, it failed because players want the BFGs, and will grind till they are ready to claw out their eyes just to get the BFGs. The imbalance caused by this causes an arms race that will systematically burn players out from each nation as they engage in this arms race.

The only way, IMO to stabilize this is to remove the BFG. Take the damn carrot off the string and people will no longer run after it untill they collapse.