Privateer conquest roles & suggestion

[Will Kinney]

I began the game the same as many, I just picked the class that sounded like fun and went for it. I didn’t know anything about the game mechanics so the class decision was basically an ignorant one. As I became more experienced and interested in participating in the RvR aspect I noticed a trend that was heading towards one logical conclusion. Port Battles are not meant for me as a Privateer. There are many other threads that I won’t rehash here that describe the specific issues why this is happening, but needless to say my personal opinion is that PB’s will be heavily NO dominated if not NO exclusive in the near future. My first reaction to this discovery was dismay. PB’s were the grand, epic showcase of the PvP experience that drew me to the game and I probably wouldn’t even participate in one. Or if I did, I wouldn’t contribute very well, my ship would sink quicker than others, and I'd become a liability to my teammates. In which case I would voluntarily reject any PB offers but miss participating in the full experience of the game. Clearly something must be done! Privateers must have some role in PBs, right?

The arguments defending the status quo (again, won’t repeat many of them) basically point out that historically when nations attacked with full force, armadas of SOL’s rolled in to battle each other for supremacy. You won’t find any historical records of any privateer ships at Trafalgar, or the Nile, or … anywhere really. And you know what, that argument convinces me. There’s no need to try to shoehorn privateers into port battles which are clearly (historically, and from multiple game mechanics) the realm of the Navy.

However, each class should have it’s own grand role in the global RvR struggle, and I believe we can look to history to see where the privateers fit in. As we all know, privateers were used by nations as proxy agents to exert force without *officially* becoming involved. Nations did not start conflicts with SOLs, they ended conflicts with them. I think you can guess where I’m going here.

My proposal is this: From 0 – 3000 unrest points the contention system remains largely unchanged. However, unrest generated by NO NPC kills is reduced by 2/3. Or unrest generated by privateers in increased by 3. Why, you say? That’s a significant number! Well, at the earliest stage of a national conflict, you didn’t see a lone or small group of SOLs sinking merchant vessels within sight of a port. To go from calm and peaceful to SOL groups the next minute attacking a bunch of fishing boats is a bit absurd and historically inaccurate. Remember, SOL task forces required time to mobilize; they required a lot of preparation. In addition to these changes, 3000 unrest points unlocks the Blockade PvP status at the port. Blockade status occurs between 3000 and 6000 unrest points. From 6000 points on contention system operates unchanged as this period is essentially open warfare (i.e. nerfed NO unrest removed).

From 3000 to 6000 points the Blockade PvP mission occurs as an instance at the port, accessible to anyone within port range or from within the port itself. This instance is open without restrictions 24x7 to all players with only the player cap limit per nation so long as the blockade unrest status remains. The player cap is this: 4 players (any) + 6 players (privateer) per nation. As long as this instance is occupied by any player from any nation, you MUST travel through the blockade instance to leave or enter the port. The mission would be similar to the “blockade runner” missions we’ve all done in PvE. Incoming players (friendly or enemy) would spawn 1200yds or so from the port. The incoming players then have to reach the port in battle space in order to enter and access the port. Exiting players would exit into the instance from the coxswain, and travel through the battle instance to exit the port at 1200yds or so. The point is this blockade instance is the ONLY way to or from the port itself. I think you see the ramifications here. Friendly players may enter this instance to wait and guard the port. Enemy players bringing in econ drops will have to run through this defense to get to the rebel agent. On the flip side attacking players can enter to blockade the port. And friendly players will have to travel through THEM for defensive econ drops. A blockade force will also disrupt all shipping in and out of the port.

This Blockade status opens up a huge potential for PvP skirmishes prior to the eventual 24 vs. 24 NO SOL slugfest. This also an opportunity for privateers to play their historical role. You’ll notice the blockade is not privateer exclusive, navy guys can enter, up to four of them. Why only 4? The navy is still mobilizing the armada and that takes time. The navy doesn’t have a full SOL task force ready at this stage.

The main point here is this: NOs can have the Port Battles with their SOLs. Those sound like great fun and I sympathize with arguments that say this is how it should be. So instead of trying to invent ways to get the other classes into PBs (where they honestly don’t belong), lets let each class have its own unique roll as important as PBs. My intent is honestly not to demean NOs, but to give them (and each other class) it's own important and equal specialty.

P.S. Despite my bold assertions, I am no historian so I may be wrong on some points. Additionally, I realize and expect Pirates and Freetraders would need their own equal and unique roles that I have omitted because I’ve written enough already.

[Lorvaton]

This is really weird, I was thinking about the same thing just the other day. It would be a really good idea to have this kind of blockade missions against enemy players trying to enter the port, as it is now its way to easy to jump an npc when there are players around and sneak in while invicible even though a full group of players are standing just outside the port. The players trying to enter should of course be given a chance to organise themselves to a convoy. A waiting list or ready-room kind of instance could be used perhaps.

To prevent that all blockade-players are just 6 level 50s sitting in Sols, the blockaders could start more spread out in the instance so they need to first locate where the enemy is comming from and also need fast ships to intercept it. The players trying to enter the port could of course be 6 Sols, but then the privateers and pirates just let them pass probably( as they would have done historically aswell), or perhaps try some daring hit and run manouver.

This would give both the privateers and the pirates a chance to disrupt transports and the enemy economy atleast.

[JJ The Wolf]

SINCE Privateers are not allowed even a 4th rate ship, this would be a very nice perk to give people an incentive to use the skill tree. Another thought I had is that Privateers need the 'piracy' skill to be made allowed pvp in pirate zones, this should be turned on and off not permanent. Thus allowing Privateers to do what they did best, work for the navy but also go rogue as they occasionally did.

[Mat le Fou]

Fellows, get to 50, grab a Mignone Privateer Indiaman for Port Battles, and Sunk those bloody 4th rate finger in the noise with the right Outfitts

[Soron]

What are the right outfits ?

[elessaria]

I would suggest armoured hulls, accuracy guns, turning rigs; with range and damage mods like maybe Betrayers (Internal) 12% damage, Explosive Powder (Powder Room) 15-17%, and a good Odysseus mod (Cannon) for +7-9 accuracy. With your spike damage skills you will be able to punch through enemy DR like lightning opening up their structure for your SoLs to target.

[Will Kinney]

I appreciate your suggestions Mat and elessaria, but how about this scenario. Take the exact set of upgrades you mention and put them on an Alexander. I'll take the Alex.

A second issue that has grown on me as I continue to think about it is whether or not we want to have a bunch of Privateers in port battles. Maybe we don't *need* to have career equity in PBs if there are other unique roles that Privateers can play. Maybe the blockade idea is not the right one, or would need modifications. But I'm curious if others have the same feeling that balance can be achieved, not through PB career parity, but with discrete career roles.

[gary0044187]

most prestigious group to get into on spanish side antigua is the black group. mostly privateers but all fast ships, used to be tritons but since they got rid of them, conq sleeks. maybe hercs and herc sleeks and MCs in the future. But they are the ch'i to your Line ships cheng.

[Garbad_the_Weak]

I have written on this subject several times, and don't want to repeat myself. If you want to read, check some of the old posts I made. Suffice it to say privateers are not worthless in RvR.

[Will Kinney]

Garbad, I have read many of your posts, especially those in the Careers section, and I agree with much of what you have to say. I truly did not intend this thread to be a simple rehash of the "Privs need a bump" discussions that have already been thrashed out already. I do not think Privateers are worthless in RvR. When it comes to generating or reducing OS unrest they as effective as any, maybe with a very slight advantage if only for Sanctioned Piracy. I will happily continue to use my Privateer in all sorts of tasks in the future.

Rather, my line of thought stems first from the notion that Privateers will be the minority in future Port Battles. Not worthless, pointless, or obsolete; just underrepresented in this very specific environment. And second, I’m OK with that honestly, for all of the reasons I mention in the OP. So if Privateers are less than advantageous for this task, is there a task that they are most suited for? The Blockade instance was just one idea. It sounded like fun. Just adding another interesting task to the overall conquest strategy. It might be the kind of thing that Privateers where good at historically. Now devising a game mechanic that might favor Privateers without being arbitrary was difficult. Maybe my proposed limitations failed at that. But I still think the Blockade idea sounds like fun and deserves merit as a general concept, if not as a Privateer specific mission per se.