Port Battles Nationals vs. Pirates : an unresolved issue ?

[valkiria]

Well, there is a problem that, for what I can see, is as old as the game: Port Battles between nationals and pirates.

The issue being here that these Port Battles are and will always be skewed and unbalanced in favour of the Pirates as long as the issues creating this inbalance will not be fixed somehow by FLS.

And what are they ?

The fact that Nationals will hardly, but VERY hardly bring any real good ship to Battles with the Pirates because chances are that it would just mean a gift to the Pirates of some 1st or 2nd Rates or couronnes or Hercules MC and so forth.

Therefore, these Port battles inevitably end up with Pirates most always having a better fleet and massacring the enemy with the quite obvious result that nationals don't see a point as to why they should go to these battles to get massacred and these Battles, most often, go deserted.

We need to come up with a solution to even out and balance nationals and pirates in these Port Battles if we ever want to see also battles between nationals and pirates lively.

Possible solutions could be that in Port Battles pirates LOOSE their ability to capture enemy ships, for example.

Also, another solution to balance out forces and give an incentive to nationals to actually bring their good ships to these Port Battles could be motivate nationals to go to these battles and actually bring good ships in order to win them by giving to Ports that Nationals succesfully defend from Pirates 4 or 5 days martial law instead of 2. This way, nationals would have a good reason to actually make an effort to win against pirates in these Ports to have more peacefull business afterwards....

Another possible solution could be introducing new items : the not tradeable Marks of the Law (like marks of trade or Marks of War) which only nationals can obtain if they succesfully win a Port Battle against the pirates (if they loose they get none). This Marks of the Law would be the only items exchangeable for new cool refit ships or unique outfittings.

This way, if nationals wanted to get those new cool refit ships or outfittings they would HAVE TO participate to port battles against the pirates and actually WIN them which means, have to bring their good ships to these battle.

But the pre-requisite to any other solution or incentive is de-activating during port battles the ability for pirates to capture nationals' ships. As long as the pirates maintain this ability, hardly any national will bring 1st or 2nd rates or any other SOL to a port battle against the pirates.

I don't think there is much one can do. It is not possible to force players to fight the pirates and even if it was, it is not possible to force players to bring their 1st and 2nd rates or other SOLs.

So, Port Battles against the pirates will always be unbalanced in favour of the pirates and nationals just desert them as hardly anyone enjoys being massacred in a port battle for clear inferiority of ships.

It is necessary here, to consider how much hard work there is into building a SOL.
Why would a National ever be willing after all of the hard work put into making a 1st rate, for example, to see a pirate, any pirate, just capture it in a few minutes ?

It is, the way I see it, a slap in the face of all the hard work and time they put into making it. Of course that nationals will hardly bring it to a Port Battle against the pirates.....

Nope. The one and only condition, IMHO, to even be able to start considering ways to make Port Battles between nationals and Pirates is to make the ability of pirates to capture ships go away, temporarily, during Port Battles. Unless this is done, I don't think it is possible to make Port Battles between nationals and Pirates ever interesting.

Or well, there would be one, which is LIMIT the ability of what ships pirates can bring to a Port Battle toning it down to whatever the nationals are bringing.
But I don't like this option.

I much prefer seeing the capturing ability be blocked out during Port Battles and have big ships on both sides fight epic battles than see port battles filled of cutters on both sides....

[Pir ate]

the problem is if you start do eventually have ethe incentive for Nats v Rats PBs the rats fleets will become severely depleted as 1 loss would mean an entire fleet of capped SoLs that has taken months and months to build up would be wiped out.

The pirates, with the Treason being the only viable built ship would be out of PBs for months while they capture a new fleet.

[valkiria]

Originally Posted by Pir a te the problem is if you start do eventually have ethe incentive for Nats v Rats PBs the rats fleets will become severely depleted as 1 loss would mean an entire fleet of capped SoLs that has taken months and months to build up would be wiped out. The pirates, with the Treason being the only viable built ship would be out of PBs for months while they capture a new fleet.

But as of now having empty port battles nationals vs. pirates helps noone anyways........

Some viable solutions needs be found out to make them lively and hard fought again.

[Kivek]

but with your proposal after 1 loss to the rats they will be jsut as one sided just in favour of the nats not the rats, and the only thing atm keeping them 1 sided is the nats themselves not the game, if this proposal would go ahead (doubt it) then it would be the game making it one sided not a choice

[Khayr_Ad_Din]

Pirate's taking a port doesn't inflict damage on Nationals, and vice versa. Nor does it matter in terms of RvR (Which Pirates are irrelevant until having won 27 battles minimum)

Solve that problem and people will fight the battles. Don't make arbitrary "incentives", as they won't really do anything.

[valkiria]

Originally Posted by Kivek but with your proposal after 1 loss to the rats they will be jsut as one sided just in favour of the nats not the rats, and the only thing atm keeping them 1 sided is the nats themselves not the game, if this proposal would go ahead (doubt it) then it would be the game making it one sided not a choice

The purpose of this thread is to have us players on all sides come up with viable solutions to the problem...

The issue is all there, though, IMHO.

The point is that for a National to make a SOL is a royal pain and any national hardly want to see a pirate take it away with a few minutes' work....

That's, IMHO, the main #1 issue why nationals do and always will be reluctant to bring their hard obtained SOLs to Port Battles.

Unless this is changed or adjusted somehow making it not that easy for Pirates to get in a few minutes what it takes weeks or months to nationals to get, Port Battles between nationals and pirates will always be unbalanced and deserted, IMHO.

[Kivek]

on invincy nats on many occasions have brang 1st and 2nd rates to fight us, losing them to the rats isnt much of an issue from what i have seen and my experinece as a nat, losing a big ship in a pointless battle is the big issue, with 27-30 winning PBs to win a map and the port getting given back after short period just means there is no pont to fight except for the fun of fighting

[valkiria]

Originally Posted by Kivek on invincy nats on many occasions have brang 1st and 2nd rates to fight us, losing them to the rats isnt much of an issue from what i have seen and my experinece as a nat, losing a big ship in a pointless battle is the big issue, with 27-30 winning PBs to win a map and the port getting given back after short period just means there is no pont to fight except for the fun of fighting

I am sorry but it is not that easy, I think.

Fighting against a national in a Nation vs. Nation Port battle means fighting against a set of players who, be them naval officers or privateers or freetraders have as a team the same skill set as one's own.

Fighting against Pirates means having to deal with a skillset totally different and, once cannot not notice it, a skillset that helps quite a great deal with boarding and fighting AVCOM.

So, a National bringing a hard earned 1st rate to a Port Battle against pirates is quite more exposed to loosing it to boarding than he or she would if the Port Battle was against other nationals.

I don't think this is an issue that can go overlooked because, the way I see it, it DOES influence nationals on whether or not they may want to bring their hard earned SOLs to Port Battles.

[Dietrich Konigsberg]

But removing the ability to cap is a complete jib to the pirates it's part of being a pirate after all, I don't see why they would agree to it.

I also don't really see the difference in being capped and losing a dura apart from being "the guy that got his 1st rate capped".

I can however see the difference between losing your rate boat at the Battle of Cayo de Marquis and at the Pirate Raid of West End

[valkiria]

Originally Posted by Dietrich Konigsberg But removing the ability to cap is a complete jib to the pirates it's part of being a pirate after all, I don't see why they would agree to it. I also don't really see the difference in being capped and losing a dura apart from being "the guy that got his 1st rate capped". I can however see the difference between losing your rate boat at the Battle of Cayo de Marquis and at the Pirate Raid of West End

You do not see a difference ?

Well, if I imagine a Port battle with 24 1st rates captained by pirates I do see a difference....

And, "if" nationals were forced to have to bring their 1st rates to battles with pirates it would be only a matter of time before we see 24 1st rates on the pirates side....

It only takes a pirate to board a 1st rate with some skill and decent outfit and the 1st rate is captured.

No thanks, pirates have it way too easy to capture ships as of now to make it possible for nationals to really brings SOLs to Port battles with them, constantly......

Something HAS to be done to CAP pirates' ability in capturing SOLs in port battles or nationals will always be reluctant in taking them, IMHO.