Feedback Thread: Ship Skills

[Taelorn]

Use this thread for any feedback you have in regards to individual skills, chains or career skill sets. The more specific the better.

[bonelizzard]

That skill that reduces agro on the OS for pirates is a real waist of a point.

I have to get it to get tack upwind, I dont need it. Usually I am PvP flagged when looking for PvP so the OS agro is not a problem. If I am PvEing then getting jumped by an NPC is not such a pain, as long as it isnt lowbie.

I would suggest that the changes made to the PvP flag rules negate the need for this skill. Could we get something good instead?

[Captain Lackey]

Need more sticky.

General:
1. Sailing skills which are attacks that give you a little bonus, that gets lost when getting hit, really lose a lot of value when swivel guns are enough to deactivate them. Culprits are Privateer Tracking Shot, Hit and Run, Freetrader Ranging Shot, Naval Officer Warning Shot, and Pirate Hit and Run. Probably one or two I'm missing. Is it possible to change them so that swivels on a 4-8 second reload don't deactivate them, only actual long guns?

Repair skills:
1. FT repair sucks given that it requires holding unsecured cargo, and it doesn't fix much. Plenty of previous suggestions about that, anything would be better than it is now. Personally, I'm of the opinion of making it really beefy and requiring the materials, which are used in making a special "ship repair" consumable that is used by the skill, rather than the unsecured planks and canvas.

2. Similarly, NO repair sucks, but not as much. It repairs much faster, and repairs structure. What it needs is a higher % repaired, 30% preferably. I am of the opinion that it should be on par with the sum of both Pirate and Privateer armor+sail ones. Pirates/Privateers have the advantage of having the flexibility of choosing to repair sail, or armor, or both.


Freetraders:

I think Freetraders need serious sailing skill work. Linked timers on the career skills are a super killer. Sailing skills should be about SAILING, and not production. CAREER skills should be about production. That said, the Logistics line is a tad weak to sub in as a Career line.

Proposal:
1a. Scrap the entire career line.
1b. The Logistics line has to go into the Career line. Preferably reduced into 3 skills into the career line. Economy: Production and Economy: Manufacture at 10th, Trade Connections at 20th, Dockyard Contract+Economy: Shipwright rolled into one skill at 40th. At 30th, have a new skill acting as a multiplier of the effect of Experts. Something nice at 50th.
1c. Replace the Logistics line with something related to combat. FTers don't have any glaring weaknesses, but neither do they have anything that shines, except reload rate. They could use something crew-related.

2. Might be me, but I don't like that the Battle Preparations is such a long, inflexible duration. I much prefer the way the Privateer Battle Preparations are set up. I'd change the duration from 30 minutes to 15 minutes, and have a linked reuse timer of 10 minutes. Plans change.

Naval Officers:
Navy isn't quite so bad, but they do need one drastic change.

1. Remove the structure and crew damage requirements from the Desperation line.
1a. Lengthen the reuse timer on Desperate Shot a tad in this case.

2. See above about repairs

Privateers:
1. Remove the negatives from Unpredictability line skills. Lower Unpredictability morale costs to 40 or 45. That'll make two Unpredictability skills more useful than other options that exist, and make the whole line more palatable.

2. Lengthen Surprise Attack to at least 90 seconds.

Pirates:
Though I have a Pirate, as my highest character right now even, I can't really comment on them, because apparently I don't play piratey enough.


As it stands right now, I prefer being a Freetrader, despite the lack of decent combat grade ships, and the skill problems.

[akdavis]

Privateer

Unpredictability: Grappling
This skill seems to exist solely to either serve as a deterrent or make you feel bad about spending a point on it to get Unpredictability: Offense.

At the incredible cost of 50 morale (constant) and reductions in your speed, defense, maneuverability and - most importantly - damage!, you get a constant effect +15 grappling offense. Pretty sad when you consider that one of the cheapest and most abundant outfitting drops provides a 15 boost to grappling defense.

I'll take Decimate over this skill any day, especially when stacked with Foul Lines and Cripple Enemy as needed. The opportunity to board seldom drags on for more than a minute, nor are you likely to be alternating between trying to board and not trying to board once you are yard arm to yard arm with an enemy. If it is dragging on that long, then you probably didn't prepare the target properly anyways and the +15 isn't going to make much, if any difference. Certainly not at all a decisive skill like some other Tier 4 options. Nor is it at all meaningful for such a "buff" to be hidden from your enemy, and to tout such as an advantage of the skill. It is going to be quite obvious that you are trying to board.

Maybe if it provided a significant boost to your own grappling defense, this skill would have enough flexibility to warrant its cost and skill point investment, and actually have some value in being hidden from your opponent.

As it is, it is just a wasted skill, or uncomplimentary skill, like many others in the privateer line, like spending points on the PvE skills Evade Aggression and Grease the Wheels to get to a purely PvP skill (Sanctioned Piracy) or to get the same stat boost that Pirates get after investing in a speed buff, and which is then followed by an even more powerful speed buff. But that whole chain of skills should be the subject of another post.

[GundamX]

I'd back captain lackey's post, a great deal of the FT suggestions has been discussed a lot.

NO: Needs good active shots, what they have is lacking. The desperation shots should work similar to FT/pirates, not wait til 50% structure to be usable.

Defense: These skills that boost ship defenses are good for low level use, when ships are small, or medium. They can evade very well with defense. But when people level up and use large, and later huge ships, defense does not do much for these ships.

Should be changed to a flat damage reduction boost, or a damage resistance buff.

[Valance]

You need to sticky this or it will get lost.

1. Freetrader - Rum Rations
I have a slight problem with the Rum Rations skill:

Reload Rate: +15%
Turn Rate, All: +10%
Ship Acceleration: +10%
Maximum Morale: +10

Freetraders don't need Maximum Morale +10, they have very few skills that use Morale in battle, most of them using the moral before battle or out of combat for buffs. Any playing a freetrader ever short for Morale?

I have a suggestion: Change the Max Morale +10 to Crew Recovery Rate +10%.

I realize this skill is also a pirate skill, so that is why the Max Morale is there. Perhaps it should split into a different skill.

2. The Logistics Line of Freetrader skills.
They need to give access to more advanced recipes. For my last several builds I only took the first 2 skills in the tree. This build I'm taking none of them. Why? For what I'm currently producing there is only 1 recipe it gives me. More advanced recipies would be nice, and not all for large stuff.

2a. This is sort of related. But I think it's kind of bogus that after taking the skill you have to buy the book that gives you the recipe. Freetraders are using a skill point, they should just get the recipe. Also the guy you buy the book from only exists in San Juan. He's been missing from Port Royale and Point-a-Pitre since about September. People have been squawking about that for a while.

3. Freetrader Career Skills: The Freetrader missions in addition to giving the career skill, should also give you one or two of the expert consumable. I'll bet most Freetraders never use thier career skills until a month in because they can't afford the expert.

4. Navy Tree: Desperation. I can never see myself taking any skill in this tree, because I have to be heavily damaged to use them. I'd rather take other skills that help me fight all the time. Quite frankly, I don't want to ever be in a state where I have to use these skills, and putting my skill points in other areas does that.

5. Navy Skill: Boarding Discipline, Privateer Skill: No Quarter and Expert Mercenary: +1 Boarding Party Level almost never matters. And if it did, Avatar Combat is broken.

6. Navy Skill: Military Communications. Any skill that only gives access to a chat channel will always suck. This should do something else also. At least the Freetrader one (Trade Connections) also lets you view all of the Ah listings in the World... which quite frankly is much more of a reason to take it than the Trade channel.

[Captain Lackey]

Originally Posted by Valeroth 5. Navy Skill: Boarding Discipline, Privateer Skill: No Quarter and Expert Mercenary: +1 Boarding Party Level almost never matters. And if it did, Avatar Combat is broken.

Ooh, I forgot about that one, especially given that "No Quarter" is also a career skill.

I'd also add that Pirates have "Bloodthirst" for a +1 boarding level.

[blam684]

Run them down is an incredibly powerful PvP skill. The fact that it persists in combat means that even without the Pirates superior speed skills you would still get run down and hit with one of the other pirate disabling line skills. That being said, I am not a fan of any in combat slowing skills that you do not have to use disabling shot for, so take that with a grain of salt.

I agree that the navy desperation line is a crock. When you get to that point in a line battle you don't stay and try to do more damage, you peel away and repair. In an ad-hoc you may have a reason to use it, but that is too much of a situational line. Give navy players something they can really use.

Freetraders need a bit of love (not as much as most people think, but they definately need some), but I have stated my thoughts on that before.

Privateers are very solid, but instead of the grappling skill I would like to see unpred: off as a 4th tier skill and the 5th tier skill reduce the negatives of the unpred line or else give 10 or so morale as a passive skill. edit: or as akdavis said give a + to grappling defense also.

Also, get rid of all of the +1 to boarding level skills (as it was stated before that level isn't supposed to make much of a difference in boarding) and the -aggression open sea skills (or at least put the -aggression skills in their own line or at the general trainer as they are a waste to most players).

I don't know too much about pirates, but I would like to see them get a smuggling class too.

Edit: I just read through and realized I restated quite a few points.

[akdavis]

Originally Posted by blam684 Privateers are very solid, but instead of the grappling skill I would like to see unpred: off as a 4th tier skill and the 5th tier skill reduce the negatives of the unpred line or else give 10 or so morale as a passive skill. edit: or as akdavis said give a + to grappling defense also. Also, get rid of all of the +1 to boarding level skills (as it was stated before that level isn't supposed to make much of a difference in boarding) and the -aggression open sea skills (or at least put the -aggression skills in their own line or at the general trainer as they are a waste to most players).

My general opinion on all privateer skills and skill chains is that anything that encourages boarding (and consequently avatar combat) as the One True Way for the career should be abandoned or made final tier, and therefore opt-in, as there is very little incentive to chose boarding combat given the lack of rewards and the current avatar combat system (except beating the NPCs quickly). It is just not that fun and should be purely a function of play style and ship choice, not career choice. I chose privateer to command an independent ship of war, not to pilot a cartoon character through a run-of-the-mill MMORPG style fighting system.

I'm sure there are people who get their giggles out of it, but I see no reason for that be encouraged within any particular career, and even if it were, it would seem to more properly to reside in the pirate profession, given that they should have the primary incentive to board and take an enemy ship both for rewards and because of likely opposition in PvP.

[tfsmick]

A few thoughts on some FT skills.

1. The buffs. I haven't taken these as I've heard they can't be used together. Assuming this is correct, they seem entirely underwhelming and not worth the skillpoints. How about them being toggles? If they cost 35 points each to run, you could run three, if you had rum rations going as well, but no other skills. Would allow changing on the fly and some tactical decisions to be made.

2. Ranging/Tracking shot. Pretty well useless for PvE play, applies to other careers that get this as well.

Not ship skills.

3. Advanced production skills. Less time for the same cost is little use when the economy is already flooded with product and I'm my profit margin is the same as anyone else's. Please consider making the reduction apply to the cost of production.